equivalent potential temperature

Gisele Zepka gzepka at DGE.INPE.BR
Tue Jan 26 11:36:11 EST 2010


I will use temperature and relative humidity at surface from wrf model 
(TMPsfc and RHsfc).
I think that I need to find the surface pressure from the variable pressfc.

Gisele



Em 26/1/2010 14:23, Jeffrey Duda escreveu:
> Which model data are you using?  American models should have data for 
> surface pressure.  It's usually called pressfc.
>
> Jeff Duda
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2010 at 10:08 AM, Gisele Zepka <gzepka at dge.inpe.br 
> <mailto:gzepka at dge.inpe.br>> wrote:
>
>     Well I have a problem then.
>     I run the wrf model and it has 42 levels. The surface pressure is
>     defined as 1013. This is my lowest level when I set z=1.
>     I really don't know how to get this Mb.
>
>     Gisele
>
>
>     Em 26/1/2010 13:59, Andrew Revering escreveu:
>
>         If you're using GRIB data, you should find a SFC level. You
>         don't want to
>         set it to 1013 because that isn't necessarily the suface. In
>         many cases that
>         will be an imaginary, extrapolation below ground (in the
>         mountains for
>         example).
>
>         Look for 'SFC' in the inventory of your GRIB data for the
>         proper level. You
>         should be able to find Tc, Td, RH for the 'SFC' level in there
>         to do the
>         calculations.
>
>         So to clarify... MB would be the MB at the Surface. How that’s
>         defined
>         exactly in your data set you'll have to figure out, but you
>         don’t want it to
>         calculate it for 1013, unless you wanted a geopotential height
>         like 850mb
>         done.
>
>         Andrew Revering
>         Convective Development, Inc.
>         http://www.convectivedevelopment.com/
>
>
>         -----Original Message-----
>         From: GRADSUSR at LIST.CINECA.IT <mailto:GRADSUSR at LIST.CINECA.IT>
>         [mailto:GRADSUSR at LIST.CINECA.IT
>         <mailto:GRADSUSR at LIST.CINECA.IT>] On Behalf Of
>         Gisele Zepka
>         Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 9:50 AM
>         To: GRADSUSR at LIST.CINECA.IT <mailto:GRADSUSR at LIST.CINECA.IT>
>         Subject: Re: equivalent potential temperature
>
>         Thanks a lot Andrew.
>
>         As I said before, I will use model data to calculate theta-e.
>         If I set
>         the surface in the model, it is 1013 hPa. Is this the level
>         that I need
>         to consider in Mb (station pressure). If not, what is Mb? All
>         Tc, Td and
>         RH are catch in Mb level, aren't they?
>
>         Gisele
>
>
>         Em 26/1/2010 12:59, Andrew Revering escreveu:
>
>             You can calculate the Theta-E from ANY level. The typical
>             levels of
>
>         interest
>
>             for severe weather are 850mb and the surface. Values of
>             330K or greater
>
>         are
>
>             usually indicative of instability great enough for severe
>             weather. If
>
>         you're
>
>             looking at severe weather, I probably would use the
>             surface. Likewise, you
>             can use the gradient you get from Theta-E, overlay wind
>             barbs at the level
>             you're calculating (surface or 850) and you get a real
>             nice idea of where
>             the boundaries are at that level.
>
>             The disclaimer is there are a LOT of other parameters
>             needed to really
>             identify a situation as severe-worthy though.
>
>             I don't know if GrADS has a function for it, but the
>             'saturated' potential
>             temperature (Theta-E) can be calculated with either of the
>             following:
>
>             Tc= temperature in degrees C
>             Td = dew point temperature in degrees C (if needed)
>             Mb = station pressure (be careful to note this is not sea
>             level pressure
>
>         or
>
>             altimeter, they are all different)
>             M = Mixing Ratio (calculations below if needed)
>             RH = relative humidity
>             Ms = Saturation Mixing Ratio (if needed, calculations below)
>             Es = Dry Saturation Vapor Pressure (calculations below if
>             needed)
>
>             ThetaE = (Tc + 273.15) * ( 1000 / Mb ) ^ 0.286 + (3 * M)
>
>             OR
>
>             ThetaE = (273.15 + Tc) * ( 1000 / Mb ) ^ 0.286 + (3 * (RH
>             * (3.884266 * 10
>
>         ^
>
>             (( 7.5 * Tc ) / ( 237.7 + Tc )) ) /100 ))
>
>
>             M= RH*Ms/100
>             OR
>             M= ((0.622*E)/(Mb-E))*1000
>
>             Ms = ((Val(RH) / 100) / Val(M)) * 100
>             OR MORE ACCURATELY
>             Ms = 0.622 * Es/(P - Es)
>
>             Es = 6.1078 * exp([(9.5939 * Td) - 307.004]/[(0.556 * Td)
>             + 219.522])
>
>             Andrew Revering
>             Convective Development, Inc.
>             http://www.convectivedevelopment.com/
>
>             -----Original Message-----
>             From: GRADSUSR at LIST.CINECA.IT
>             <mailto:GRADSUSR at LIST.CINECA.IT>
>             [mailto:GRADSUSR at LIST.CINECA.IT
>             <mailto:GRADSUSR at LIST.CINECA.IT>] On Behalf
>
>         Of
>
>             Gisele Zepka
>             Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 8:40 AM
>             To: GRADSUSR at LIST.CINECA.IT <mailto:GRADSUSR at LIST.CINECA.IT>
>             Subject: equivalent potential temperature
>
>             Dear all,
>
>             I am interested to analyse the atmospheric instability
>             when a storm
>             occurrs using equivalent potential temperature from
>             mesoscale model.
>             What atmospheric level do I need to check to get an idea
>             of instability?
>             I don't have a theta_e output, so I will calculate it from
>             temperature
>             and humidity data from model.
>
>             Please, any help will be nice.
>
>             Thanks.
>             Gisele
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>     -- 
>     Msc. Gisele dos Santos Zepka
>     Atmospheric Electricity Group (ELAT)
>     National Institute for Space Research (INPE)
>     Av. dos Astronautas, 1758
>     São José dos Campos/ SP/ Brazil CEP 12227-010
>     Phone ++55(12)39456841
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Jeff Duda
> Iowa State University
> Meteorology Graduate Student
> 3134 Agronomy Hall
> www.meteor.iastate.edu/~jdduda <http://www.meteor.iastate.edu/%7Ejdduda>


-- 
Msc. Gisele dos Santos Zepka
Atmospheric Electricity Group (ELAT)
National Institute for Space Research (INPE)
Av. dos Astronautas, 1758
São José dos Campos/ SP/ Brazil CEP 12227-010
Phone ++55(12)39456841

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